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Post by gwnwar on Nov 29, 2015 21:31:18 GMT
Remember that there is a rubber "O" ring to seal tube to rear to the goose neck bit..
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Post by zeitgeist on Dec 23, 2015 0:19:40 GMT
Update. Well I'm almost retired with 40 days off over the holidays and 2 work days and a wake up at the end of January left. I couldn't pass up the nice weather we had today but got a late start around noon. I managed to get the suspension off the subframes front and rear if a little unconventionally. I pulled the rack and pinion off no troubles. Next up was pulling the front and rear calipers as well as the front rotors. I was able to loosen all the front control arm bolts with no issues and after pulling the cotter pins for the front upper and lower ball joints I loosened the castle nuts on both top ball joints easily. The driver side lower ball joint castle nut came off easily enough but then I ran into some trouble.
I couldn't and still can't get the drivers side lower ball joint to separate from the spindle/upright. I tried my usually successful hammering on the side of the spindle near the ball joint as worked with tir rod ends and upper ball joints. No joy. I then went for the pickle fork and hammered away at the joint to pry them apart. Again no joy. I then tried both wedging the pickle fork in as far as it would go and the hammering on the side of the spindle near the lower ball joint and still no luck. I ended up pulling the lower control arm off the subframe with lower ball joint still attached.
Any help here is appreciated as I am at a loss.
On the passenger side the lower ball joint problem was even worse. The nut spins the ball joint stud in the ball joint so it doesn't loosen. If I had an air compressor and 1/2" drive impact gun this may not be an issue but alas I don't have either yet. Getting an air gun in the space may be a problem anyways as it is tight.
Any help here is doubly appreciated.
Onto the rear. This went OK as all the nuts came off easily enough. The upper control arms were a breeze and the lower control arm inner bolts and nuts came off fairly well. My problem is that I cannot get the long lower outer bolt on the lower control arm to rotate or push through the control arm or rear upright on either side. Is there a trick to this or is it as I suspect rust welded into the upright?
I removed the front swaybar and disconnected the rear from the control arms leaving it attached to the rear subframe. Since I couldn't separate the rear uprights from the lower control arms I removed the lower control arms, uprights and axles as an assembly. I'm stuck here as well as the fronts as I want to do poly bushings all around since the car has almost 200k miles.
I have used the (brute) force but ( the MEV brain trust)Obi Wan you're my only hope.
I removed the exhaust disconnecting it at the manifold. I managed to break one stud as it was almost off. One nut looks stripped and that stud the threads look ragged near the tip.
I disconnected the fuel and breather lines and pulled the fuel tank off with some help from the misses. I soaked the nuts for the diff mounts again and the motor mounts which are the only thing connecting the front subframe to anything and rear subframe to anything. Soon ready for removal and soaking in Evaporust.
Too tired and too dark to take pics tonight but will first thing after starting tomorrow and will post them. 4 1/2 hours and accomplished a decent amount.
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Post by greg on Dec 23, 2015 2:39:44 GMT
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Post by zeitgeist on Dec 23, 2015 3:08:10 GMT
That looks like it may work for the one side I got the nut off. Have you used it on a ball joint where the nut spins the ball joint? I have never had that happen before. In the past I have had an air compressor and air tools and at least a Mapp gas torch. Using all hand tools has not been much of an issue other than a little slower. |
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Post by gwnwar on Dec 23, 2015 4:56:02 GMT
A BFH to the uprights will pop the ball joints loose..
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Post by jon on Dec 23, 2015 12:45:33 GMT
I assume you are replacing the ball joints?
You could just cut off the nut and spindle. Might be your only option.
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Post by einy on Dec 23, 2015 14:24:53 GMT
I had similar issues removing one of the long bolts that goes through the rear lower control arm / rear upright, since the PO of the donor car hit something significant with that rear corner of the car. In short, the long thru bolt was bent, as did the lower control arm itself. The upright was OK, so I did need to remove this bolt to allow its re-use. Method successfully used was to cut the long thru bolt in two places - each 'gap' between the lower control arm and the upright (i.e. - either side of the upright). If memory serves, there is enough room between these elements to be able to make a tedious hacksaw cut through the bolt, without damaging either the lower control arm, or the upright. Since you are replacing your bushings anyway, no harm done if you cut into those guys sleeves. After I made these cuts, all sections of the (now three piece) bolt came out without further problems.
To be honest - if I had it all to do over again - I'd probably spend a bit more money and go with replacement rubber bushings. FM sells an 'aftermarket' complete kit of approx. 40% stiffer rubber bushings for ~ $400. I believe they are made by a company in Germany to the same specs as the Mazda competition bushings. I put in a Prothane kit, and despite lubing the crap out of them, my fronts already are noisy. At a minimum, I'd definitely look into putting zerk fittings at every joint if you go with poly bushings to keep them lubed.
Hope this helps !!!
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Post by jon on Dec 23, 2015 14:45:23 GMT
I had similar issues removing one of the long bolts that goes through the rear lower control arm / rear upright, since the PO of the donor car hit something significant with that rear corner of the car. In short, the long thru bolt was bent, as did the lower control arm itself. The upright was OK, so I did need to remove this bolt to allow its re-use. Method successfully used was to cut the long thru bolt in two places - each 'gap' between the lower control arm and the upright (i.e. - either side of the upright). If memory serves, there is enough room between these elements to be able to make a tedious hacksaw cut through the bolt, without damaging either the lower control arm, or the upright. Since you are replacing your bushings anyway, no harm done if you cut into those guys sleeves. After I made these cuts, all sections of the (now three piece) bolt came out without further problems. I did the same thing. Had to cut both long bolts through the lower control arm/knuckle. I got my sawzall inbetween the knuckle and arm as einy did on both sides. Still, I had a hell of a time pounding out what remained in the knuckle. It was the toughest two bolts of my life. It looked like this:  I finally got it off by drilling out the bolt about half an inch, then sticking another bolt in there to pound. Used a torch and a sledge hammer. I had to hit it many many times as hard as I could. It was an all day struggle!  |
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Post by zeitgeist on Dec 23, 2015 15:27:17 GMT
Thanks gents for all the replies and suggestions. I think I am going to get some Mapp gas and a torch head as well as the ball joint pusher Greg pointed to and give it another try. I also don't have a bench or vice yet as it is just an empty garage with a single light as a work space. I hated my old garage because it was a lot smaller and had oil caked broken up floors but it had lights,bench,vice, and air which I am learning are quite beneficial when really needed. I soaked the daylights out of everything with penetrating oil and wacked the uprights as hard as possible with a large ball peen hammer for 10 minutes. Has anyone had any luck with or suggestions for using the cold freeze spray that works similar to but the opposite of heat? I never tried it but it may be a safer method around parts that are near where heat can damage them.
I also may try and find a nut splitter for the front ball joint where the nut is turning the stud.
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Post by zeitgeist on Dec 24, 2015 2:31:03 GMT
Made some progress. First the ball joint pusher from Harbor Freight Greg posted the link to doesn't fit between the upper ball joint spindle boss and the lower so I couldn't use it. Oh well worth a try. What did work was a bit of heat from a Map gas torch and spraying CRC Freeze penatrant spray. This stuff seems to work very well as I was able to get the nuts off the swaybar end links that were stubbornly refusing to budge. I was able to get the stuck ball joint separated from the spindle as well as loosen the castle nut on the passenger side and get that ball joint out easily. Both using a little heat and the CRC cold spray.
The long bolts on the rear lower control arms on both sides to the upright didn't work out so well. I ended up cutting the bolt between the control arm and upright. Once the control arm was free the ends of the bolt fell out from the control arm but the bolt center was seized in the spindle. No amount of heat, freeze spray,penetrating oil and hammering made any progress. This looks like it will need to be drilled out or centered drilled and knocked out or pressed out.
This means the control arms and all the hardware are ready to be detail cleaned and soaked in Evaporust. I picked up 2 gallons while running around getting tools. Tomorrow I hope to drop the front and rear subframes and prep them for evaporust treatment.
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Post by zeitgeist on Dec 24, 2015 2:35:39 GMT
Forgot to mention the time of 3 hours to keep track of that and that I was able to pull the handbrake cable from the tub after separating the front cable from rear cables after some soaking. I also pulled the fuel filter bracket which I missed removing somehow and surprising this came off super easily but looked rusted and ready to break.
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Post by einy on Dec 24, 2015 17:30:10 GMT
For the bolt section remaining in the rear upright, I used a drill mounted rotary wire brush on every spot that I could get to on the exposed shank of the bolt, and a week or so of twice daily spraying with PB Blaster or equivalent. Pressed out on a hydraulic press after that, no problem. Fortunately, I have a work friend with one in his garage. That was also handy during a-arm bushing removal!
I'd strongly suggest using new OEM Mazda bolts when you replace these as they are not just regular old bolts, and spend a bit of time with a suitable round file on the uprights' thru hole making sure they fit snugly but are still hand insertable (is that a word?) in the reclaimed upright. I coated mine with anti-seize upon reassembly.
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Post by greg on Dec 24, 2015 19:33:01 GMT
Made some progress. First the ball joint pusher from Harbor Freight Greg posted the link to doesn't fit between the upper ball joint spindle boss and the lower so I couldn't use it. Oh well worth a try. . Crap! Sorry to hear that. The one I have must be smaller as it worked perfectly for me. |
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Post by zeitgeist on Dec 24, 2015 22:22:44 GMT
Einy, I'll try the wire brush method as I have a set of those type brushes I got to clean up suspension and subframes. I would like the cut the center exposed section out and then center drill the ends as I think that would get it close enough to come out. It is just that the back side of the exposed section is blocked from cutting with hack saw,saws all etc.. I am thinking about drilling through the exposed section instead as it seems once one side is free the other will come easier.
I plan on getting a 20 ton HF press for the bushings so maybe I should move that up in time and see if it helps on the bolts once cut or cleaned up more. I had a similar problem when I built my Spec Neon on the long lateral link bolts in the rear. Worked on it for hours but it eventually loosened up. I always use anti seize where reasonable as it makes rebuilds and tear downs so easy in the future.
Good point on the control arm holes for poly bushes. Overall the control arms and most of the bolts,nuts and adjustment washers look to be in good shape. Some still have the original coating and none have visible wear or rust deterioration. I may try and re-use some but may also just spend the $80 on the new set for peace of mind in case they are torque to yield. I'm getting close to ordering the poly bushes, new motor mounts,tie rods and ends and whatever else is needed to get the subframes and suspension done. I need to strip and have the rack welded.
I hope to have the rollerskate all rebuilt and refreshed by March so that when the Race chassis comes I can focus on it and get it painted or powdercoated as soon as the weather allows. Shooting for a driving, track ready car by May.
No problem Greg on the suggestion it was a good one and may have worked. I'm sure I will use it for something.
Anyone have any thoughts on good front lower ball joints after Jon's ball joint failure? This is obviously for a NB and many listings aren't clear on differences if any between NA and NB ball joints.
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Post by zeitgeist on Dec 25, 2015 21:23:44 GMT
Merry Christmas. I hope everyone is having a good Christmas and happy holiday break. The weather here is phenomenal. I haven't done much with the holiday time but I did manage to get some Evaporust and soak the suspension hardware for 24 hours and rear upper control arms. The stuff works very well. I am impressed by the whole easy process. I cleaned the parts and filled a plastic storage bin yesterday. The stuff has almost no odor and comes out the consistency of water a clear yellow color. I placed the cleaned parts in the solution and covered the container loosely. I set it on my second bathroom counter to keep the temps above 65 degrees F. Here is a picture or two of the parts as they went in.   Here are some after they were removed and the solution washed off.   The solution turned brown and cloudy but no real odor or viscosity change that I could tell. As I washed the bolts some of the factory coating came off. This was a dull grey coating that was thin and a bit flaky. After rinsing and drying the parts with a towel then can of air I sprayed them with WD40 to prevent rust returning right away. I forgot to take pictures of the upper control arms but they came out rust free with all the paint that was not bubbling still intact. I also soaked one caliper bracket and hardware. These also came out rust free and the rubber slider pin/bolt grommets seemed unfazed. Today I placed 1 front upper control arm in the solution with the container tilted to keep the ball joint out of the solution. I also put in a very rusty front center handbrake cable,mount and spring, the second caliper bracket and hardware and the super rusty pair of needle nose pliers I found in my house crawlspace that have probably been there for years.  So far I am impressed with the ease of use and how well it works. I have no connection to the company and was skeptical it would work so well. |
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