Jason Exocet type G build thread

[kiwicanfly]

Oh, and just to add a final twist, folks are very keen on their locktite but a mechanical locking device is so much better (lock washer, spring washer, Nordlock washer)

Simply for this reason, if you ever check your bolts again for whatever reason you will crack the locktite. Say you forget if you tightened a bolt and you decide to check it the next day the locktite is now compromised.

The only fasteners I used locktite on is floor fixings.

[jason82]

Fantastic, thankyou ever so much.

[daydreamer]

Kiwi, I think you summed it up really well. I have learnt a lot over the last few years about bolts and the theory behind the correct selection and application in different scenarios. Coming from blissful ignorance about bolts when I started my build to a stage where I am now know that I don't know enough, previously I did not recognise that. This is one of those subjects that could do with its own section on the forum as every kit will use hundreds of bolts in many scenarios.


Getting it wrong, as is so easily done, will result in a much reduced mtbf which is at least inconvenient but probably expensive and painful as well.

[jason82]

That's it then ! Brexit style debate it is !  Seriously though, thankyou both. Given that the Exocet uses the same mounting bolts, maybe we could do with a black & white answer on the subject, as potentially this could be a safety issue. I would not like to think of the knock on effect of play between the chassis & subframes. The torque rates are quite high, & I don't think that caveman tight will be enough on this occasion. Using a bar on a 1/2 inch drive ratchet could potentially put the bolt at breaking point, meaning any excess strain could shear the bolt off. Can anyone on here answer this question ?

[kiwicanfly]

There is no "debate" a bolt has a specified strength rating.

From this rating you determine the torque required.

Part of the torque requirements is to overcome friction hence the variations in torque for dry and lubricated.

If you under tighten the bolt it can come loose.

If you over tighten you can break it.

Putting a higher rated bolt than original into something then using lower torque than specified because you are afraid you will strip the threads is very bad practice. If the part will only take an 8.8 bolt use an 8.8 correctly, not a 12.9 wrongly.

And, believe it or not, in addition to the above stronger is not always better. Bolts above 10.9 can break when under cyclic loading and thus a 12.9 can be less safe than a 8.8.

And NEVER have your old bolts plated to make them "pretty", unless the plater can get them heat treated afterwards as the plating process can impart chemical stress into them making them super-weak (can't remember the name for this).

[jason82]

I kind of breezed through the engine build progress a bit without posting. To be honest, I had the radio on, a mug of coffee & just kind of fell into a trance & forgot to take pictures of the progress. I will save you all the boring details, but one section that I did want to share with everyone was the piston ring orientation & how I got the pistons into the cylinder head.

 To start off I got some clean engine oil and rubbed it around the piston rings, then I used the Summit racing piston ring orientation guide to assemble my piston rings. ( no guides were given with my piston rings & there appears to be various recommendations for which way they should go, but the Summit racing guide kind of made sense).

  If you imagine the piston with the front of the piston facing north, I put the oil scraper ring on first with the join facing south. You then have 2 oil ring scraper retention rings, the bottom one faces south west, & the top one faces south east. Then definatley use the ring pliers to open the top two rings, the middle one faces north west & the top ring faces north east. Here is a pic....

After looking at various different ring compressor tools, I knew right away that I did not want to buy the standard can opener with an allen key style compressor, as I have seen quite a few failures where people have broken rings with these. Then the Wiseco cylinder ones looked really good, but at almost £55 it was too much. So that lead me to this really nice little set from AB Tools. The compressors are really nice, are slightly tapered & the pliers to squeeze the compression collars is a ratchet type, so you do not need to squeeze really tightly, while trying to keep the tool tight against the block, while tapping the piston down.

All you do is make sure that the collar is the right way up (it says bottom on the bottom edge), smear oil on the inside of the collar, squeeze in the ring compressor while making sure that the rings are squeezing into the grove correctly & away you go !

I found it  so much easier to have the skirt of the piston hanging out of the bottom of the ring compressor & lowered the piston into the block. Make sure that you hold the bottom edge of the ring clamp tightly against the block, otherwise a ring may pop out & get trapped, then give the crown of the piston a few gentle taps with a rubber mallet.

  To be honest, no matter what piston ring compressor tool you have, whenever you put a piston into the cylinder block, your heart will always be in your mouth. Its an incredibly satisfying job when its complete, as it starts to finally look like an engine. On the piston, rings & cylinder walls, I used a high quality engine oil only & assembly lube on the bearings etc. The reason for using engine oil on the pistons etc is due to some speculation that assembly lube can prevent the rings from moving freely as its quite thicker than oil.

 With regards to the main & big end bearings, make sure that they go into their correct locations, as this can prevent the oil from flowing. For instance, the main bearings have a hole in one of them which matches up to an oil galley in the block.

Before you fit any bearings into their correct locations, make sure that you thoroughly de grease the bearing houses, put the bearings in bone dry, then you use assembly lube on the bearing faces. If you lubricate where the bearing clips into the housing, you will spin an engine bearing & wreck your engine.

 Here is a picture of my engine from a few days ago. Since this picture I have put the power steering pump on coolant hoses & done the timing etc. Unfortunatley I could not put the intake & exhaust manifolds on as the pipe going from the exhaust to the back of the intake manifold will not fit between my engine stand & the engine. The same goes for my flywheel. Apart from that its ready to drop into the chassis. This should be done tomorrow hopefully.

[jason82]

Late yesterday evening I started bolting on the power steering bracket & instantly came across a problem. Can you remember that little bolt that is blocked by the bush ? the one where you had to push the nose of the bracket down to release ? Well I suddenly remembered that last night & could not get the thing hand tight let alone torqued down. So after a bit of thinking I came to the conclusion that the bush was a press fit, so I got a long 1/2 inch extension bar & gave the bush a few kisses from the back of the engine towards the front of the engine with a hammer. (the power steering bracket was bolted to the block already via the top two bolts).

After 3 good taps, it popped out....

Here is the bush, I gave it a really good wire brush prior to refitting. (this is the bush prior to cleaning).

With the bush now out & the power steering bracket torqued down to 43nm (obtained from Haynes manual), I then had to put the darn thing back in. After building two kit cars you learn very quickly how to improvise, so I made a tool. All
you need is a long M10 bolt ( can be found on the gearbox to engine bolt pile), which threads through the end of a 19mm socket with the end that goes onto the ratchet going through the bolt first, thread that through the bush location hole, pop the bush onto the m10 bolt, then a washer, followed by a nut. Then you have a puller tool that will pull straight.

Note: Do not use a socket smaller than a 19mm as the push pulls through its locating ring & pops out the other side, which will then go inside the socket.

Before I refit the bush, I gave it a bit of a coating in engine oil to help it go back into the mount, then used a 1/2 inch ratchet & spanner to tighten up the thread, pulling the bush back into its place. You will need to get the pump to make sure that the bush is located far enough into the mount for it to fit. Mine went in perfectly first time. I would not use any bolt smaller than an M10 (M12 bolts are too big), as the bolt will more than likely snap under the pressure. I am quite pleased with this outcome as I really wanted to retain the power steering, & had already bought new tie rods & track rod ends for the power steering rack.
One thing that I did notice, if you do delete the power steering pump, make sure that you put the bolt back into the mount in the top front position, as it goes straight through to the engine insides. I also used thread lock on the mounting bolts. I hope that this helps someone !

[jason82]

Its been a really productive week. To start off I approached a company called Forest fasteners for some technical advice on how tight these chassis bolts should be. Very quickly I had the reply 90nm dry, so that was brilliant to have a definite answer from someone in the fastener world, so that's qualified enough for me !

Next up I had my dominator 2 headlamps come through from a company called on ebay called mbs ltd. They were the cheapest that I could find in the uk & were £235.98 for 2 pairs, delivered. The item number is : 253702466122, the service was amazing & they were delivered in double quick time. They are very well made & are quite heavy, so I am a happy lad. After an email exchange with iva technical, I was told that they are  fine as long as you have a set of dlrs fitted. My dlrs (Phillips daylight 9) were £62, so that's £300 for the set up.

I had a few issues mounting my fuel tank, basically the rear panel would not completely cover the tank and it sat up a bit at the back. I rectified this by mounting the tank underneath the chassis & butted up to the factory fitted mounts. I mounted my tank with the filler on the passenger side rather than the drivers side, because I did not like how tight the fuel filler hose was, and I anticipated that it would take ages to fill the tank, due to the tight bend. The rear cover fouled whatever way I mounted the fuel tank with it mounted on top, but I must say, things fit a lot better with it mounted underneath.

  I had to drill the tank on two of the four mounts, this was not an issue as I drilled through the flashing. I drilled a 9mm hole, then used an M8 bolt from the top, with a thick rubber washer between the tank & chassis, then a large washer with nyloc underneath. Initially I was worried about clearance between the tank & rear subframe, but with my mk1 tank, it fits nicely. On the one corner where I could not drill through the flashing due to not enough material, I used the existing hole bolted to a piece of 3mm steel plate, then bolted it to the nearest mount.

  I have ordered a 51mm x 500mm fuel hose from CBS, which will connect my fuel tank to the petrol cap. At the moment I am using the standard MX5 fuel cap & gubbins, but I may change this for a nice billet one from kitspares. The trouble is, it needs to have the breather pipe adaptor & the set up will cost around £170. A cheap option that I have come across is on ebay, if you type marine fuel caps into ebay, you get some really nice boat ones that will fit perfectly & are a fraction of the cost.

I simply ran a hose to atmosphere with a check valve connected to it from the vent outlet on the tank.

I then made a strap out of aluminium to keep the fuel filter from flapping about & bolted it to the mounting point (not in this picture), then fitted a 15mm copper pipe connector to the corner tank mount to keep the fuel lines nice & safe.

I had pre drilled the ppf months ago with a 9mm  drill bit, at 200mm intervals, where I used an M8 x 40mm bolt to bolt the pipe clips to it. I ran the fuel pipes down the driver side of the ppf, where they fit snuggly. If you use this method, you will also need to drill the plastic pipe clips out to 9mm to accept the M8 bolt. I used M8 bolts as I was a bit worried that M6 bolts may fatigue & break off with the weight of carrying two fuel pipes (flow & return).

What is not very clear in this picture is that just above the fuel clips is a 7mm hole drilled at the same 200mm intervals, where I can use an M6 bolt to secure the brake pipe clips to the ppf. I have used stainless clips with a rubber insert to wrap around the 3/16 brake pipe as it will be more robust than the cheap plastic clips.

The pipe has two further clips not shown in this picture, one is right on the corner of the chassis rail, & with the other clip, I put a bracket on the very front of the ppf, where there is a c section cut out, where it bolts vertically to the gearbox.

I purchased 8m of 8mm i.d high pressure fuel hose from Kitspares months ago & it was just right. Basically i ran the first piece of pipe from the middle outlet on the tank (feed) down to the fuel filter to the 'in' port, then ran one continuous line from the filter, to the engine bay & looped it back up to the return on the tank, this way i can cut the pipe in the engine bay wherever i like. 8 meters was perfect, this left a really nice sized loop in the engine bay ready to be connected to the engine. To make things easier, i ran the feed along the top of the pipe clips & return along the bottom of the clips so that i do not plumb the pipes wrong.

 The fuel pipes will be run straight to the fuel rails instead of using a barb fitting, connecting my new rubber hose to the old one. As an electrician, i hate joins as it is a source of a potential problem. To help me with this, i have not mounted my intake manifold to my engine, this way i have direct access to the fuel rail

 Next up was the handbrake & cables. This was a bit of a pain in the butt as i had to open up the holes where the handbrake cables pass through on the gearbox tunnel. The holes are way too small, its not a powder coat issue as i had to use a carbide grinding bit in my drill to remove the steel, opening up the holes. Once they were opened up enough to fit perfectly, i came across another problem. The bracket that the cables passes through is too thick for you to put on the handbrake retaining clips & required a little bit of attention to get the retaining clips to fit.

  With the two handbrake cables now fitted, i coupled them up to the short handbrake cable, put the handbrake in the down position, & wound the adjuster screw on the handbrake all of the way in. This way i have maximum adjustment at the handbrake. With the short cable pulled taught (handbrake in off position), i then marked where the mounting points of the handbrake was located, then drilled them out to 9mm to take an M8 bolt. As the gearbox tunnel was off, it was easy to get my hand on the nuts in the tunnel. I could have used rivnuts on the handbrake, but i felt that the handbrake would need something a bit more significant.

 The handbrake was later removed, sanded down & painted in gloss black. Further more, the little cable clip between the handbrake handle & the 2 into 1 joiner was secured by drilling a 7mm hole into the gearbox tunnel, i then used a piece of chrome tube to go between the chassis & this clip keeping it secure with an M6 bolt ( not in this picture).

Finally, i got all of my wishbones mounted, steering connected (using brand new tie rods & track rod ends) & the wheels & suspension fitted. It was really nice to finally get this thing rolling & steering like a car.

The anti roll bars are not connected in this photo, but they will be. I had also not lined up & torqued down the wishbone adjuster bolts, as i was having a spot of bother trying to locate the picture that i took of them when i stripped my donor, but to be honest, i will get the car re aligned to MX5 specification, as  its on standard suspension & its all identical to how it was on a standard car.

  At the start of the build i was really concerned about how the suspension gave the appearance of drooping on kits that i have seen before, caused by using lowered suspension. I looked into getting the shock tower mounts from Exomotive shipped over here, but then i decided to scrap the lowered suspension kit that came with my donor & replace it with original MX5 shocks & springs. This proved to be a good choice as the wishbones are now parallel to the ground & gives a nice ride height.

 I will be hitting the kit hard again this weekend as i will hopefully be getting my iva date through the post. I also have a week off work coming up where i plan to get this finally finished.

My build initially was really slow due to refurbishing parts etc, and the chassis & panels sat fairly untouched. I went through a period of putting in loads of hours with no visible progress, & then all of a sudden i find myself simply bolting on finished parts & my progress has been fairly swift. If i could give any builder one piece of advice, it would be to make a to do list. This sounds really lame, but put even the tiniest of jobs on the list, this way you can visibly see progress. I have hit this wall before & my Haynes Roadster got shelved for almost a year.

  Even if you have 5 minutes free, pick a really small easy job & you will see the difference this makes. My must have tool for the build has been my camera. I originally started stripping my donor 10 months ago, and at the time i knew where everything went, but now i don't. Take random pictures of everything, as it may prove key to how something goes back together, especially when doing an engine rebuild.

Happy building !

[jason82]

Finally got my iva date, 22nd March, so the heat is definitely on. I have been flat out in all of my down time trying to get the kit finished. I will do a proper update when I get home tonight with progress pictures etc.

[hammy3601]

Wow! great effort to get it done for the IVA date from where you were back at the end of January! My IVA app is also in and going in April. Best of luck!

[jason82]

A quick update,

My gearbox tunnel was secured using rivnuts & M6 x 20mm hex dome bolts, with an old bike tube cut into strips to use as a gasket between gearbox tunnel & chassis to hemp eliminate squeaks.

Wiring the rear pod was pretty easy, basically I tiger sealed some cable tie mounts across the roof of the inside of the pod, straight down the middle, then ran the wires in split conduit feeding the rear for, reverse light & number plate lights.

All of the rear loom was intercepted at the rear of the handbrake tunnel, put into waterproof connectors, then the tank wiring stayed permanatley plugged in. The rear wing light wiring was ran across the chassis in split conduit. I then ran a 6mm earth wire from the tank mount to the ppf to keep Mr Iva man happy.

The rear pod was mounted using 4 rubber rivnuts to try & eliminate stress cracks in the panel. So basically all you need to do to remove the pod is unplug the rear harness plugs by the handbrake tunnel, unscrew the fuel filler cap mount, then the 4 M6 bolts & the rear pod comes completely away, leaving the rear lights still connected.

I then put some mesh around the master cylinder bars & opposite side & secured them with 37mm p clips for the main large tube & 18mm p clips for the small tubes. Basically I wrapped the stainless rubber p clip around the bar & simply bolted the mesh to the p clip.

My Hyundai Getz header tank has been bolted up to the n/s front, I just need some header tank hose now. I love this header tank, it's very slim & fits perfectly.

Next up is my altenator & starter motors. I wanted to buy new, but they are quite expensive. Luckily my brother knew of a company near me that can rebuild them. After a quick call a rebuild price for the two was £80 plus vat, a huge saving over new & they will be ready on Tuesday next week all ready for the start up.

Wiring tray

My wiring tray is 110mm deep which is perfect. I have drilled a 70mm hole in the n/s front of the aluminium to run the n/s loom down to the lights etc & another 70mm hole in the driver side of the box to run the o/s loom down. The rubber grommets which are already on the wiring loom secures perfectly into the 70mm holes.

The hazard & console dimmer switches have been mounted in the bottom right corner of the box, I simply cut two rectangles into the ally, & slid them into the tray. I will find out the rectangle dimensions when I get home & update the thread accordingly. To cut the rectangles, I drilled loads of holes in the shape that I wanted, pulled out the waste material & used a carbide drill grinder thingy to clean up the edges & make them nice & straight. I drilled two a hole in the bottom of the wiring tray then for the pedal wiring & for the rear wiring harness to run down. The rear wiring harness was ran down the back of a filler panel that I made to go between the top front of the gearbox tunnel & the wiring tray, then ran up the gearbox tunnel.

My wingstays have been mounted onto the hubs, the rears required longer bolts, so I purchased 4 more front brake calliper mount bolts, which were perfectly long enough, using loctite on them before tightening them down. At this moment my wings are resting on the mounts, as I am unsure on how I want to mount them. I prefer p clips for the security, as my wings are black, I may get away with using small m6 black domed bolts, but we will see.

I have mounted my exhaust front & mid sections already, but I have not decided on how I want the rear silencer. I have a few options available, but nothing that really grabs my attention.

My hard brake lines have also been ran, I just need to mount the flexi lines. I may leave this until last to be honest because I don't want to fit brand new discs to the car now only to have them rust up before the test.

Regarding my bonnet, I have ordered an old Ford F100 pick up bonnet bracket kit from the states. Basically it bolts to the front upper chassis beam by the radiator & then gets mounted to the bonnet. This kit then enables the bonnet once it has been un latched using the aero catches, to pull towards the radiator and tip forward, using guide rails. Of course it won't fit straight out of the box, but with a bit of fabrication I hope that it will work perfectly, if not, at least I have thought outside of the box.

Rear diff seals

I ended up buying these from Autolink due to being on MX5parts waiting list for 6 weeks. The quickest way to remove the old seals is to use a claw hammer, make sure that the claws are only stuck into the inside rubber edge, then lever them straight out. To replace them I simply smeared Vaseline around the outside edge of the seal, held the seal square & used a piece of wood S a drift & hit the wood with a rubber hammer to get the seal to fit flush. I ran some Vaseline around the part of the seal that the half shaft slides through to stop snagging & that was that. Don't forget to refill your diff with oil.



Sorry for the lack of pictures, I am self employed & incredibly busy at work. When I get home I am on this kit every night. It's a pitty that you can't upload pics off your mobile phone on here. I have a week off coming up where I should be doing the dreaded books,but instead I plan on spending it on this kit. I will of course update this thread when I have 30 minutes spare to sit down with my laptop at home.

The speed of my build in the last few weeks has been down to months of rebuilding parts in my shed, now that they are all complete it's a matter of bolting them on. With my iva only next month, it's all hands on deck !

[jason82]

Oh, one other thing, I have been helping Stoney racing to develope an MX5 heater matrix by pass pipe. This should be available to order within 5 weeks or so.

[kiwicanfly]

Feb 6, 2019 10:09:14 GMT jason82 said:

The speed of my build in the last few weeks has been down to months of rebuilding parts in my shed, now that they are all complete it's a matter of bolting them on. 

A freind who was restoring an old car told me that the best way to do it was to remove a part, restore it, put it on the shelf ready to fit, move to next part.

This way your final build doesn't keep halting due to having to restore a small bit that "seems" to take ages.

[jason82]

I fully agree. To be honest, as moral starts to drop off as it always does, bolting on finished parts gives you that final feel good factor to get the job done. It's almost instant job satisfaction, especially as the major spending has come to an end ! Hopefully. Lol

[jason82]

I just wanted to share the MK1 1.8 rear lower suspension to hub bolt torque. I could not find it anywhere, but after a call to MX5 Heaven, I can confirm that it is 73 - 90 nm.

I wish that I asked before as I broke one of my brand new bolts costing £18 + vat. Lesson here is never trust someone who is not a professional. I was given a torque spec on a different forum of 130 nm & my bolt broke straight away.

Basically I have gone through the car double checking that everything is torque correctly & putting a tipex Mark on it when it's tightened properly, this way I should spot an untightened bolt pretty quickly.