Standard or Custom Build

[stuwrex]

New to the Forum, hello all.

Kit ordered and deposit paid with Scott.  The big question is to complete the kit as design or modify during the build.  Seems to be a few American builds who have adapted the body work.

While some form of weather enclosure is planned after the trike has been signed-off, I am tempted to alter the donor for a touch more power to handle more weight and increased rolling resistance.

Thinking CBR600 donor, lengthened wheel base, similar to the Rayvolution Evo I expect.

Car hubs to allow for slightly wider track and more rubber.

Would love to hear from anyone who has looking into kit tweaks.

[erik]

Reading this forum and many threads for 1+ years now makes some very interesting results regarding reversed trike concepts. More like to see a closed version of the tR1ke and eco-exo. many like more power in the eco-exo and I would dig a tilting version a lot on the eco-exo-r. Last friday I adressed this to RTR but reality is Stuart is a very busy man and it isn't likely good concepts are upgraded.

Do note the Burgman engines can be tuned and transmission can be optimised for acceleration. I heard a story a tuned Burghman is hard to keep up with up to 60mph. Reality is your cbr600 conversion might be a bad choice for street use. as you noted,a wider track would be good but you might have a poor base to start with. The rayvolution concept is very nice. Personally I think it would be very cool to see an Atomic front narrowed to a single seater from the dash to the rear. the wider bonnet would be great for luggage room inside the chasis. A wide swingarm and rear tire would be prio#1 to make an official street legal dragstrip racer hehe ;-D

Perhaps I will present this thought on a silver plate to Stu and make him fall in love on that concept.
For the time being, my tR1ke is at RTR now for MVSA and see if I like this kit when street legal. Perhaps I might build an other kit in future.

greets,
Erik

[ray.h.]

ive been giving this type of vehicle a lot of thought lately too. I realy like the idea of a single seat reverse trike for commuting and nipping round town.i was thinking of changing to car uprights too (maybe Fiat Cinquecento or something very similar)It seems to me whole can of worms though. As soon as you start adding car parts then the weight goes up and then you start looking at larger engines which adds more weight and therefore thicker tubing and more of it which then gets it in to the class of the tR1ke.Which has already been done. Basicaly if you want light then go eco exo. if you want more power and car steering then go tRike. I cant see much point of anything in the middle.

[edvb]

ray.h.

Spot on

But that does not mean making improvements for comfort and durability.

Roger, Jimmy and I all have a different idea for finishing our trikes to suit our needs.

I just wanted comfort in cooler weather and be able to do trips and carry my supplies and clothing.
I also wanted streamlining for better gas economy and a larger gas tank.

Last was some adjustability of the castor and camber instead of camber and toe in only.

Hopefully I will achieve all the goals I set and come up with a machine that fits me.

[ray.h.]

I must admit I love the idea of such a light weight little machine but like you say a bit of storage would make it more practical and more conventional hubs would be better. im currently trying to source buggy type hubs and a centre mount rack for sensible money which would improve things no end. im not too bothered about upper weather protection but it definitely needs some sides to stop the spray in our lovely british summers.

[edvb]

I am modifying my A-arms for adjustment of caster but you are talking about a new front end. That can be done but that seems like a major redesign.

That already has been done by Scott.


DSC00197 by evanbelkom, on Flickr

[Stiggy]

Jun 23, 2013 14:58:04 GMT stuwrex said:

New to the Forum, hello all.

Kit ordered and deposit paid with Scott.  The big question is to complete the kit as design or modify during the build.  Seems to be a few American builds who have adapted the body work.

While some form of weather enclosure is planned after the trike has been signed-off, I am tempted to alter the donor for a touch more power to handle more weight and increased rolling resistance.

Thinking CBR600 donor, lengthened wheel base, similar to the Rayvolution Evo I expect.

Car hubs to allow for slightly wider track and more rubber.

Would love to hear from anyone who has looking into kit tweaks.

As the designer of the Eco-Exo I have to say I am a little concerned. It is great to be in this business and I openly encourage people to introduce their own features and twists to my concepts but there has to be a limit.
Styling your own body is one thing and the only real implication being road legalities.
Changing an engine from a twist and go to a bike engine has major potential implications however.
More power generally results in more weight, more speed and more stopping power being required.
This can impact on suspension set up and could easily become too onerous for the type of wishbone pivots, ball joints, chassis mountings, spring loadings and shock absorbers etc.
The rule of 9 applies, change one thing and coc 9 others up.
Changing to larger wheels will result in a higher ride height, altered roll axis, higher centre of mass (COG).
Changing to chain drive will result in a longer wheel base.
The polar moment of inertia will change and could result in stability issues.
The modifications considered by builders should always be done in a way that respects the original ethos and design criteria, it would be a sad day if 2 MEV's were ever built the same but a more sad day will be the one when an accident occurs through the use of an empirical design approach.
On the other hand for more speed and power why not look at RTR's tR1ke when you have finished your Eco-Exo.
Sorry to appear to put a damper on what seems like great ideas and enthusiasm but we need to avoid camping in oxygen tents.

[edvb]

Part of the problem we have in the states is they only started importing the Burgman 400 in 2003. So we have to adapt the gas tank, radiator and fuel injection to make it all fit. I agree with Stiggy in keeping the basic design intact and modifying what is needed to pass inspection in your area. In order to have side cases that I really wanted I needed to put the radiator in front. I ended up getting a 2007 Burgman 400 radiator that would work in that space and used the original bonnet and a 05 Burgman 400 windshield as a mold to fabricate what I have now. Most of these mod's are needed to make the design work here with the newer style Burgmans and be able to pass the inspections here.

Even the changes in the A-arms are minor as the geometry and size stays the same including fitting in the stock mounting tabs. Basically I am using larger Rose joints that will not affect anything structurally as I am just going a size larger. That way I can use some misalignment spacers that will give me 56 degrees of travel instead of 20 degrees and a higher radial load factor.

I hope this stays within the implication Stiggy is talking about.


IMG_1205 by evanbelkom, on Flickr

[ray.h.]

exactly the point I tried to make earlier but with out the technical wording or professional knowledge that stuart obviously has. I think the eco exo works as a package because of its super light weight.everything does the job its designed to do within the package. start altering any elements in the package and it has a knock on effect on everything else. eventualy it becomes something else. im seriously thinking about buying the kit and the only alerations ive seriously considered is a centre rack and light weight hubs but the more I look the harder it is to find a package that works as well as whats already there for the same weight.i would definitely sort out some weather protection and a bit of storage would make it much more usable.

[Scott]

As the producers of the Eco-Exo Trikes, we have to agree with the technical explanation from Stuart (MEV)

The kit is what it is, and we are also happy for builders to go their own route, we too don't want all the trikes looking the same, but we must remember there are limits!!

The Eco-Exo range was designed and built for a purpose, Commuter / Weekend cruising,, other donors are a option but they need to be of a similar design Ie - scooter / twist and go with the same power rating etc,, anything else is just not going to work, and goes against the whole ethos of the vehicle,,

If its fast and furious you want then the tR1ke is the one for you,

Regards Scott

[roger32849]

There are some very interesting comments in this thread. After starting my build and going as far as I have in the time since I received it, it has been an interesting process. If a person has deep pockets ($$$$$) and has a desire for speed, power and performance, there will always be something on the market for those people. The T-Rex, is an example of what happens when the sky is the limit. The Eco-Exo on the other hand is unpretentious and modest. It is the exact opposite of what a performance vehicle emulates, however within its own operating parameters, it is very sporty, has a respectable top end and is easy to operate. Upgrading the Eco-Exo's performance to incorporate a "tuned" engine and quick CTV should be within the parameters of what the chassis will accept. You tube offeres an open door to view just what sort of performance can be achieved when you finish making adjustments to obtain the most from your scooter engine. I own a 2004 Burgman 400. It is very fast, and has quick acceleration and can be made to go faster, quicker and more powerful with a professional tune, exhaust and electronic's added. With this in mind, the Eco-Exo is the ideal candidate for such a power plant. I like the I dea of going down the highway at 65 or 70 and still getting 65 MPG.. I do not (at this time) need to make performance modifications.

I enjoy my conversations with Edward in Wisconsin. We exchange ideas on how to make modifications to accommodate the US spec donor parts. While my engine is significantly different, it fit by relocating the mono shock attach points in the front, and by slightly modifying the upper Engine mount. Other mods were necessary .....The fuel tank had to be notched make clearance for the throttle body and cam chain adjuster.. For me, the modifications will continue until the build is complete.

In my opinion, the 2007 and newer Burgman scooter is not the ideal donor for the Eco-Exo as it is currently designed and built. I would highly recommend anyone considering doing a build and wanting to avoid serious modifications to stick with the older Burgman 400 as their donor of choice. So far, I have replaced the calipers, front wheels, and radiator in addition to mods mentioned above.

I would applaud anyone wanting to improve on an idea and making those improvements. It is understood that when making modifications, the rule of 9 most definitely applies... Everything affects everything else. The good old American Hot Rod stands in testament to thinking outside of the box. The Old style Mini Cooper was another... These are both examples when rule of 9 applies. Responsible engineering and responsible mods. Avoiding an oxygen tent is always a good thing.

It would be great if Scott were to offer a kit that was designed for the fuel injected donor and/or to accept the 2007 and newer equipment... Or license a company here in the states to manufacture the chassis and panels for the US market. Naturally all of this requires money and I realize Scott has a busy market in his local area.

Roger