Resale, engines and geometry

[smiffy]

Hi Just wanted some honest info from owners before i dip my toe in the water.

1. Though i would build a car to keep, the day might come one day where i would want to sell. Having recently seen a couple of MEV rockets for sale on the MEV web site and other places, who people on here might know. How does the resale value hold up and what price might be expected...i know its subjective depending on spec and quality of build, but im sure people have an idea.
2. Having built a few cars before one of the critical issues is geometry. How have people found this ? Is there any or enough adjustment to set it up and is there some datum settings, for the geometry and suspension ?
3. Whilst im sure the std engines give good performance, if im going to the trouble of building a car, i would like a bit more power. Is the ST170 a suitable donor or does this cause problems. Im not familar with the ford engine and gearbox range so not sure if this is a direct repacement or a nightmare ?

[smiffy]

Ok, just found a good thread on engines and it has convinced me the 1.8 115 bhp will be fine for a start. So im good with 3. for now.

[nigel]

Hi smiffy,

In response to your question regarding geometry. I'm assuming your looking at either the Sonic or Rocket however the general philosophy of giving builders a 'high degree of flexibility' is the same across the Team MEV range of products.

The Rocket and Sonic have:-

Front and Rear Toe and Camber adjustment (rear toe adjusters are now standard on the Sonic but you'd need to confirm with RTR re the Rocket)

Caster adjustment is fixed at 8 degree on the Sonic, but is adjustable on the Rocket.

Additionally all the other things that you expect such as ride height, spring loads, shock settings, rake angle etc are adjustable.

Basic Datum setting guidance is provided in the build guides, however as the cars are of a new design, owners are experimenting, and are being encouraged to share and post there experiences and findings on the Forum in the Technical Section.

I hope this helps

nigel

[subevil]

We've just done a sonic7 with st170 Track car. Its early days yet but its working and were having fun. Would say that it adds about a month onto build as there is a little more to do in a few areas ie electrics, engine position,gear change, exhaust. This was mine and subevos first kit car build and this sight helped alot.
In retrospect it would have been better to do a smaller engine then tune it, as even a 1.6 is a hot hatch killer.
You have made a good choice, good luck.

[Scott]

Price wise, you answered yourself, totally depends on the quality of build

Scott

[mattsmev]

Hello Smiffy

I have emersed myseld in the worls of suspension set up over the winter and found the Rocket is very responsive to a bit fo time with a tape measure and a plumb bob. like many kit cars there is loads of adjustment so with a bit of reading (text books and this forum) and some chatting (at the shows) and some trial and error either car can be set up just as you like it.

engines, I am a proponent of the 1.6, but if my pockets were deep enough the 1.7 Puma Tech would be my choice, or perhaps an alluminium Duratech. however the lotus' MG Fs MX5s. BMWs and Supras that I was passing at my last track day would probably agree that a car this light does not need a very big engine.

resale cost. I only know of one owner who has parted with one yet - and he has already posted in this thread, but i know that money and fair words were exchanged, and new owner is also on this site. both very happy bunnies. As far as i know it went for more than it cost to build. try doing that with a robbin hood!

I have dealt with both MEV and RTR, both excellent

It would be good to see you at stonleigh, RTR or Stuart can take your deposit (for a rocket) then

Cheers

Mattsmev

[smiffy]

Thanks for all the great feedback. Just been doing some more reaseach and can anyone give me some insight into the Puma 1.7 as a donor. Im presuming its zetec 1.6 bored out, but sure there is a thread here somewhere already discussing this option, if you could point me in the right direction or give me some advice that would be great.

[boom]

The Puma 1.7L (125ps) was a Yamaha engine (like the 1.25L and 1.4L Fiesta engines). If you can find one, a Racing Puma (~150ps) would be a very interesting option. However only 1000 (ish) were made and they are as rare as hen's teeth.

I think they all used the IB5 gearbox, so that end of things should be straight froward. I also remember there may even have been a 1.6L Yamaha engine that came later in the Fiesta (circa 2000), but I'm not certain - perhaps someone else can confirm this.

The 1.7L is a nice engine but has variable valve timing which would require the original ECU. It's a long time since I've seen one but I think it was hydraulically operated on a helical cam in the sprocket. Can't comment on its reliability.

[mattsmev]

Wow Boom you know way more than I do

The 1.6 SE (Sigma) engine is a Yamaha unit and very easy to get from any 1.6l Focus. The Pumas had 1.7l engines that were very similar, and came in two flavours. Regular 125bhp and Racing Puma 155bhp. The Burtons Catalogue says the extra power is from a tuned exhaust, different induction, cams, timing and a different ECU. they also say you can take a regular Puma engine and get it close to racing puma spec with some tuning and or course money.

I am not sure how far a 1.6l engine can be taken. it looks like it's just a money exercise and close to 150bhp can be got from these light weight engines.

I am running mine in standard form, and to be honest, the slowest thing in my car is me. when the engine is slowing me down, I'll think about tuning.

Cheers

Mattsmev

[spaniarduk]

Hi all, especially mattsmev after you comments saying that the slowest thing in your car is yourself.

I was wondering if any one had actually timed straight-line performance on either Sonic or Rocket with standard 1.6, 1.8 and 2.0.

What are the 0 - 60 figures that u guys got out of your 'pride n joys'? I'm really curious, considering they all fall under the 600kg mark.

Thanks 2 all

J.

[r16]

i will be drag racing mine soon (in the next 3 weeks i hope), its a standard 1.6 se engine and i expect it to do a standing 1/4 in the low 13's ish.

just so you guys know ford will soon be launching a new fiesta RS... it will be the 1.6 se engine but will be turbo'd and will be putting out 180 bhp ish.

according to a ford tech who is working on the car you will be able to buy the turbo, pistons, ecu etc from ford direct as a kit to retro fit the sigma engine...

[dinosaurjuice]

Apr 5, 2010 17:44:29 GMT spaniarduk said:

...I'm really curious, considering they all fall under the 600kg mark....

HAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA as if

[r16]

will, isn't your engine 600kg on its own :-) lol

[spaniarduk]

Well.... I am aware that some of you may be struggling with keeping total weight low as well as a decent weight distribuion. Also, I never said if the 600kg was total weight or weight resting on each of the wheels! lol.

Will, precisely because of the oddity that your car is, I'd be even MORE insterested to know! . Something tells me that with the torque your engine can put on the road it may not be difficult to see some wheel spin even in 3rd gear! Am I right?? What's your 0 - 60? I bet it curves the Space-Time as well as it wrinckles the tarmac under the rear wheels! Kinda like a bad fitted carpet...

J

[dinosaurjuice]

Apr 6, 2010 12:33:57 GMT spaniarduk said:

Will, precisely because of the oddity that your car is, I'd be even MORE insterested to know! . Something tells me that with the torque your engine can put on the road it may not be difficult to see some wheel spin even in 3rd gear! Am I right?? What's your 0 - 60? I bet it curves the Space-Time as well as it wrinckles the tarmac under the rear wheels! Kinda like a bad fitted carpet...

J

its hard to judge 0-60 times. the in-gear acceleration is savage, but i have to use 3rd to reach 60 so i guess its about 5.5 - 6 seconds. it will quite happily spin wheels all the way upto 50 ;D
paul from RTR had a proper grin on his face after a little ride out in it at stafford, so it must be fairly rapid!

everyone around here is blaming the icey winter for all the potholes, truth be known it was me